Where do you stand?

[konstantin4abilene]

What religious beliefs, if any, do you follow? Please do not post on this thread if you intend to do anything other than answer the question. I wanted to see this answered without the usual insults to other's beliefs. I am a Bible believing Christian, somewhere between Church of Chist and Baptist. Most importantly, no matter what church I go to, for me it is my desire to serve God, and him alone.

[sparkys4]

Baptist predate the Reformation and the life of Luther and shouldn't be lumped in with other Protestants whose roots come from the reformers who were Catholics and left

[pills4everything]

"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice that it
always coincides with their own desires." — Susan B. Anthony

[just me]

well, i may have to agree with ms. Anthony. religion should not change to meet the wants and convenience of man. the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. sunday is the sabbath, the commandment is to keep it holy, not go out to eat after church with my preacher, then off to walmart, then mowing my yard, then back to church and play 'i am the perfect christian because i put a load of money in the plate so we can have that big pizza party to draw in the kids and lock the doors and tell them they are going to hell if they do not get baptized'


Sorry, not to be taken in an offensive way, just an opinion of how things are viewed to the 'outside' world.:confused:

[just me]

And I happen to hold Martin Luther in great regards for his knowledge and bravery. He paved the way for many others.:)

[SLAPSHOT]

I love George Carlin's classic bit about religion....funny as heck. Here's a transcript of it, but the transcript doesn't do it justice, you have to see the "You Are All Diseased" HBO special.:D

http://www.rense.com/general69/obj.htm

[SLAPSHOT]

I love George Carlin's classic bit about religion....funny as heck. Here's a transcript of it, but the transcript doesn't do it justice, you have to see the "You Are All Diseased" HBO special.:D

http://www.rense.com/general69/obj.htm

Sorry, I should've posted a disclaimer: The link I posted contains foul language.....after all, it is George Carlin.

[just me]

Now, don't get me wrong, I take religion so very serious and that is why I said what I did. I also believe that 'once saved always saved' is a bunch of lies. I think you have to work, meaning religiously work, for your salvation. I just dont believe that the guy who robs and kills will have the same glory as the sweet lady who has been very faithful all of her life just because the guy was baptized at a pizza party when he was 16. that does not make any since. :confused:

[honda05]

This (http://http://www.billygraham.org/SH_StepsToPeace.asp) will fill in the blanks.

[honda05]

Thanks, "nice" board.

Now, I'll just post it this way:
http://www.billygraham.org/SH_StepsToPeace.asp

[sparkys4]

And I happen to hold Martin Luther in great regards for his knowledge and bravery. He paved the way for many others.:)


"the just shall live be faith"

he was a great man and a brave man living in perilous times.

[sparkys4]

Now, don't get me wrong, I take religion so very serious and that is why I said what I did. I also believe that 'once saved always saved' is a bunch of lies. I think you have to work, meaning religiously work, for your salvation. I just dont believe that the guy who robs and kills will have the same glory as the sweet lady who has been very faithful all of her life just because the guy was baptized at a pizza party when he was 16. that does not make any since. :confused:

keep working at it and hope and pray you don't loose it 2 minutes before you die and you can't get it back again and you're on your way to Hades..

[shoppergirl]

Baptist

Sparkys4 - do you go to a reform church? Is there one here in Abilene?

[sparkys4]

no I don't

I don't know about in Abilene, but there is one in Ovalo I know of

[albojet68]

"just me" where do you get that sunday is the sabbath? I have looked all
throughout scripture and have never found where the weekly sabbath has
ever been changed from the seventh day. To anyone else, I would like
someone to show me in scripture where this occured...... You can't! It
happened when constantine changed it back in the 3rd century. I didn't
know a man could override the Creators authority? Hmmmm something to
think about folks! And if it were changed by man's authority, Then we are
breaking the Fourth Commandment and following the pagan ways of sun
worship, which was constantine's religion.

Paul, Mathew, John, James even Messiah, observed The Sabbath" the seventh day. And taught others to do likwise, otherwise they would have been teaching people to break the Fourth Commandment. I don't think the Son of The Most High would do that, do you?

[Yochanan]

albojet, my sentiments exactly.

I also have looked and looked and looked and can't find where it says "Thus saith the Lord, Remember the first day of the week to keep it holy." Coming together on the first day of the week is a very Jewish thing to day. They meet after sunset on Saturn's-day to close the Sabbath. So when Acts 20 says that Paul preached until after midnight (and notice that it says there were "many lights in the upper chamber when they came together"), this wasn't a marathon sermon of 12-14 hours, just around 5-6.

I answered the poll as "Other." Sounds like you and I may be in the same boat, though. Because of my beliefs, Christians would call me a Jew. And Jews would call me a Christian. I noticed that you marked Jew on the poll but write about the Apostolic Writings ("'New' Testament" to you Christians). Are you a Messianic Jew?

[albojet68]

Out of the choices given I would have to say that I would fall under Judaism as opposed to the others. Putting myself under Other would be correct also. I'm still out on the "what I would call myself" bit, I believe In the Creator, the same one who Abraham,Issac,Jacob Moses,David ect... followed. I also believe that Yahshua of Natzereth is His Son and Messiah.

I really like the term Yahudim. ????hmmmm
or there is the term given by the leaders of the Jew's "a folower of The Way.

[albojet68]

You are correct in the fact the today Jews only recognize people with Jewish mothers. However the name Jesus was not even in use in any scripture until the 15th or 16th century. Any one can reserch this fact quite easily. The poor attempt to try to translate Yahshua into the Greek was terrible at best. There is no translation, so they instead transliterated it. In Hebrew this comes out as , at best "Hey Soose"( Hey Horse) and at worst "Hey Zeus" (a Greek god). Which was the only way they could make the plian folks understand His deity. I think He would be quite offended at being reffered to as Zeus, don't you? Look it up for yourselves.

[howdy ya'll]

#
Acts 20: 7
7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

[Yochanan]

In reading the writings of a Jewish author, it behooves us to understand a LITTLE about Jewish practices. The Jewish day begins and ends at sunset. The first day of the week begins at sunset on "Saturday." Even today Jews come together to say good-bye to the Sabbath on Saturday evening. That being said, STILL nowhere is there a command by Yeshua, Paul, Peter, James, John, or EVEN God to change His commandments, which, by the way, He said he doesn't do.

And please don't go off on passages that say "God repented of ...." If you will read in context, they speak about His response to a human action which, if they had been in the center of His will, wouldn't have needed a change in response to. God's commandments have not changed!

BTW, "break bread" means to eat a meal together (at the close of Shabbat). Like today's Jews. Ask one what "havdalah" is about.

[albojet68]

That Is correct, I don't see anywhere where that changes the Sabbath. It is amazing how John and Paul and Mattew and even Yahshua, continued to keep the Sabbath "7 th day". Also the Sabbath Is the only day that has been given a name in scripture, all the other days are just numbers. But that doesn't mean anything;) Unless that is the day that Elohim set apart from the begining of Creation, and is and is going to be observed in the kingdon to come" shadow of things to come." Also the don't judge people in meat or feasts or sabbaths ect.. was for the differences in Jewish custom, didn't have anything to do with doing away with the Sabbath or dietary law's. Which still happen to be in place, Pork is still unclean, I don't see any scripture where He changed his mind on his own Commands. I can assure you The deciples and Yahshua Never had Pork chops and while Yahshua was with us or after he went to be with the Father.

Can you tell me where you get breaking bread has anything to do with the Sabbath???? Or Elohim all of a sudden changing his mind from the begining of time and just saying " ohh just pick a day, it's all good"

[bigfatfurrytexan]

The word "buddhist" is misspelled in the poll. :)

[howdy ya'll]

Very interesting furry! I have great respect Buddhist....I am Christian, and I feel that most Buddhist are more Christ like than most Christians.

I have studied a little about Buddha and his journeys. I have looked for 'the tree' because I want it for me, but havent had much luck.

[bigfatfurrytexan]

buddhism is a lifestyle more than a faith. The truths you espouse are those you discover personally on your journey.

I believe Christ was buddhist, personally. In Tibet they refer to him as Saint Issa (he travelled there in his youth, so the story goes). They revere him greatly for being great in spirit.

I follow Christ, but am not Christian. I am not sure the Christian church follows Christ...but that is for another time. :)

[sparky-4]

buddhism is a lifestyle more than a faith. The truths you espouse are those you discover personally on your journey.

I believe Christ was buddhist, personally. In Tibet they refer to him as Saint Issa (he travelled there in his youth, so the story goes). They revere him greatly for being great in spirit.

I follow Christ, but am not Christian. I am not sure the Christian church follows Christ...but that is for another time. :)

what writings do you use to guide you in following Christ?

[bigfatfurrytexan]

what writings do you use to guide you in following Christ?

a MAJOR one that is ignored by Christians is The Book Of Thomas. I also like The Book Of Judas.

There are also the NT books, but that is a given.

[howdy ya'll]

My kids and I were just reading in Matthew when Judas sold Jesus for 30 pieces of gold and we almost all asked why there was not a book of Judas......That is funny that was mentioned.

I told them that the book of Judas was probably left out on purpose because of what he did. But to me, that is a very important part and lesson about the death of Jesus.

[sparky-4]

a MAJOR one that is ignored by Christians is The Book Of Thomas. I also like The Book Of Judas.

There are also the NT books, but that is a given.

is the message basically the same theme as the rest of the NT?

[howdy ya'll]

Ya, I would really like to know myself. I would also like to see one. I have often wanted to get a Catholic Bible because I have heard they have some of the books that were left out in the KJV.

[sparky-4]

Ya, I would really like to know myself. I would also like to see one. I have often wanted to get a Catholic Bible because I have heard they have some of the books that were left out in the KJV.

you are talking about the Apocrypha, it was in the first printings of the 1611 AKJV and then removed in subsequent reprintings

[bigfatfurrytexan]

no, if you include the "banned books", you get a slightly different story. Often, the book was "banned" because it was either known to be fictional (the expanded "creation story" that can still be found in one of the jewish torahs).

however, there are occassions that I wonder if it was removed to protect some dogma that early leaders wanted put in place.

A good example: I interpret the Book of Thomas as insinuating that Jesus claims that God can be found EVERYWHERE. To me, this is supported by the statement of God saying he is "I Am".

If this is true, then it would be VERY similar in concept to the Hindu "Brahma".

All is one. As above, so below...we are created in his image....meaning God is Us. "I Am".

Here are some links to the banned books of the bible:

http://wesley.nnu.edu/biblical_studies/noncanon/acts/tomcntnd.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_banned_books

Tomorrow when i am not watching MNF, i can post more info. However, i would strongly encourage all people (everywhere on Earth) to do their own research. Then, meditate deeply on what they find. The answer will appear to them.

I am not saying that Christianity is bad or wrong. I am only saying that, when you are prepared, there is more. You just have to go find it. My mother is Christian, and i was raised Christian (Lutheran). She is actually the moderator of Church Chat at MOF, and very devout in her faith. I was lucky enough to be given not only a strong Christian childhood, but was encouraged to question everything and seek my own answers.

When i was 22 i realized by soul had become bankrupt. So i went on a journey, searching for answers. I am now 36 and have had peace for about 4 years. Even if i am wrong, i have peace in my soul. THAT is what is important, i think. :D

[hockeymonkey]

More Wiccans than jews, eh?

[TheTechGuru]

I don't know what, what I believe falls under.

I believe there is a bigger picture than the Bible.

In a nutshell...

I believe in other planes of existence.
I believe in astral-projection.
I believe that there is other life in the universe.

I think long long ago there was several planets with human life on them and common travel between them and there was a war between the planets and some people from each planet that wanted nothing to do with it escaped to earth to start over but did not tell the past history nor use their technology because they did not want their offspring's to have knowledge of it in an effort to prevent it from happening all over again and started the bible story's instead.

I'm not saying that I think the bible is a story though, I believe it to have a lot of truth.

I also believe we're still missing a lot of books from it.

The bible only took place in one part of the world as far as I know, so we still don't know what was going on in other parts of the world at that time.

So it seems that of the separate groups of people that came to earth, only a few chose to write or we have not uncovered the others yet.

I think that Jesus was a extra-terrestrial that came to earth to bring clues and info on the truth of our origin's but as it turned out, society was not ready for the truth so they killed him.

Not to detailed, but that's a basic overview.

If we dig deep enough we might be able to find clue's to the pre-bible universe. I'm thinking at the bottom of the deepest parts of the ocean.

I have a feeling the Pyramid's are a key element in the puzzle also.


Anyone know what belief this falls under even if it's only similarities. I don't know what to call myself, other than a nutty Coast To Coast AM fan. :p

[howdy ya'll]

That is the most interesting belief I have ever heard of. I have friends who are LDS(ya, I know, there are those that hate LDS, why, I havent figured it out because they are really strong Christians) and they have a book took place in America at the same time the Bible was taking place.

We have had some pretty good discussions and the things that it talks about and what has been and is being discovered in South and Central America is amazing and I enjoy hearing them compare.

But then again, I am a very opened minded person and I really love to hear all different views on what people believe. It is just wonderful and a joy for me hear other peoples beliefs, and I found your belief very interesting.

[bigfatfurrytexan]

I don't know what, what I believe falls under.

I believe there is a bigger picture than the Bible.

In a nutshell...

I believe in other planes of existence.
I believe in astral-projection.
I believe that there is other life in the universe.

I think long long ago there was several planets with human life on them and common travel between them and there was a war between the planets and some people from each planet that wanted nothing to do with it escaped to earth to start over but did not tell the past history nor use their technology because they did not want their offspring's to have knowledge of it in an effort to prevent it from happening all over again and started the bible story's instead.

I'm not saying that I think the bible is a story though, I believe it to have a lot of truth.

I also believe we're still missing a lot of books from it.

The bible only took place in one part of the world as far as I know, so we still don't know what was going on in other parts of the world at that time.

So it seems that of the separate groups of people that came to earth, only a few chose to write or we have not uncovered the others yet.

I think that Jesus was a extra-terrestrial that came to earth to bring clues and info on the truth of our origin's but as it turned out, society was not ready for the truth so they killed him.

Not to detailed, but that's a basic overview.

If we dig deep enough we might be able to find clue's to the pre-bible universe.

I have a feeling the Pyramid's are a key element in the puzzle.


Anyone know what belief this falls under even if it's only similarities. I don't know what to call myself, other than a nutty Coast To Coast AM fan. :p

this is where my beliefs were before i read a book by Dan Millman that changed it all for me. It took these scattered thoughts and focused them into something that i feel is a truth. :)

I post at abovetopsecret quite a bit (i am fairly well known there). and i LOVE coast to coast.

[TheTechGuru]

Only thing is I have not been listening as much anymore since Art Bell retired (again).

He should be on New Year's eve though, I won't miss that.

How do you listen to Coast To Coast?

I used to listen on XM but I've had to let that bill go due to the economy.

I looked up affiates on the site and I see that Abilene has one http://www.1280ksli.com but it's only 500 watts during the day and 226 watts at night. The AM loop antenna on my home theater system won't pick it up clearly over all the electroncs and computers around it.

[bigfatfurrytexan]

i find archived versions on the internet.

you can also listen to it via various streams.

Try this:

http://www.coaststream.com/stationlist.php?state=alabama

[howdy ya'll]

Has anyone studied the Native American's and what they believe? And releasing energies to the Universe and to the God's?

[dwhanson]

I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ. No denomination for me. I see all Christians as one church. Why be separated? We can be different and still be under One God.

[TheTechGuru]

Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints?

[howdy ya'll]

I think I have seen a Church of Jesus Christ somewhere out of Abilene......They are not LDS, but I agree with dw about why does there have to be so many denomonations, it is just down right confusing.

Too many translations of the Bible to fit the needs of man, too many thinking they can translate it 'right', and too many claim to be called of God to fit their own money and sick desires........some right here in Abilene.

Too many church leaders spreading lies about other churches. I quit going to a couple of churches because they kept having hate classes and preaching against other churches.....Not Christ like in my eyes.

I like to go to church to learn, and feel the spirit. Not to hear lies and off the wall stories and feel an evil spirit. What kind of church leader invites evil spirits in their church? I can turn on the TV for lies, evil and bad feeling.

Ok......I am off my soap box now.

I am my own denomination......lol

[TheTechGuru]

http://www.lakewood.cc is nice.

[dwhanson]

The point has been made. Someone asks me are you a Latter Day Saint. I'm not a Latter Day Saint I'm not a Jew. I'm not a Methodist. I'm not a Baptist. I'm not a Catholic I have a friend that is Catholic and she says they have been around since the start, and implies they have the right track. As do a lot of other denominations.

My denomination is the Body of Christ, and I see no separation in that. Jesus talked about The Church. I'm not a Bible scholar, but I don't know of anywhere that Jesus placed any additional label on The Church. I can't even explain that I just belong to "The Church" because man has taken it to the point that there is no easy way to explain that I am simply a member of the Body of Christ, following Jesus. And this does not set me against anyone. I allows me to be a brother to all Christians. That is what I am.

For some of us, denominational names do not separate. But for a great many Christians, being a Southern Baptist automatically puts them in disagreement with other denominations. Being a member of the Highland Church of Christ automatically sets them against other denominations. And on and on. Any way you try to explain it, there is division. Too many people set themselves to be against one another by using denominational names, when in fact we are after the same thing.

Why can't we be different in many ways, and still be after the same thing? Why can't two people stand next to one another, one praying silently, the other praying in tongues? Why can't we be a part of a worship service that includes A capella as well as instrumental instruments? Because we fear those things that make us uncomfortable. Many of us have been taught from childhood about our denominational rituals more that we've been taught about being disciples of Christ. Then, we are uncomfortable to be outside of our element: that is, our rituals. I've experienced that uncomfortable feeling. It came from my ignorance and insecurity.

I wonder, could all Christians agree on theses scriptures... Luke 10-:25-37 and Ephesians 4:1-16. There is a lot said about love, loyalty, and unity in these words. Is Christianity as complicated as it has been made out to be?

Unity of the Spirit. Something to consider heavily. I have had the experience of offering help to someone, and them turning down the help, because I was not of the "right" denomination(faith). THAT is not from Jesus Christ - that comes from the pits of hell. I know of nothing that says that we can't disagree, and still have Unity of the Spirit. We aren't all going to get along, but we can live in the Unity of the Spirit.

Here's something to consider. I believe that there are enough Christians and enough money in Abilene, Texas that not one person should go hungry for a night. Not on person should lack for comfort or a friend. What if all denominations, while keeping their own unique traditions, unified in an effort to offer love, food, and friendship to all who are in need? I tell you, we can gather together and solve many of the problems of this city. But we don't have to change who we are, or gather just we agree in every detail of doctrine. We can gather because we all hear the Father's voice.

[howdy ya'll]

I agree with you on so many points.

[bigfatfurrytexan]

The point has been made. Someone asks me are you a Latter Day Saint. I'm not a Latter Day Saint I'm not a Jew. I'm not a Methodist. I'm not a Baptist. I'm not a Catholic I have a friend that is Catholic and she says they have been around since the start, and implies they have the right track. As do a lot of other denominations.

My denomination is the Body of Christ, and I see no separation in that. Jesus talked about The Church. I'm not a Bible scholar, but I don't know of anywhere that Jesus placed any additional label on The Church. I can't even explain that I just belong to "The Church" because man has taken it to the point that there is no easy way to explain that I am simply a member of the Body of Christ, following Jesus. And this does not set me against anyone. I allows me to be a brother to all Christians. That is what I am.

For some of us, denominational names do not separate. But for a great many Christians, being a Southern Baptist automatically puts them in disagreement with other denominations. Being a member of the Highland Church of Christ automatically sets them against other denominations. And on and on. Any way you try to explain it, there is division. Too many people set themselves to be against one another by using denominational names, when in fact we are after the same thing.

Why can't we be different in many ways, and still be after the same thing? Why can't two people stand next to one another, one praying silently, the other praying in tongues? Why can't we be a part of a worship service that includes A capella as well as instrumental instruments? Because we fear those things that make us uncomfortable. Many of us have been taught from childhood about our denominational rituals more that we've been taught about being disciples of Christ. Then, we are uncomfortable to be outside of our element: that is, our rituals. I've experienced that uncomfortable feeling. It came from my ignorance and insecurity.

I wonder, could all Christians agree on theses scriptures... Luke 10-:25-37 and Ephesians 4:1-16. There is a lot said about love, loyalty, and unity in these words. Is Christianity as complicated as it has been made out to be?

Unity of the Spirit. Something to consider heavily. I have had the experience of offering help to someone, and them turning down the help, because I was not of the "right" denomination(faith). THAT is not from Jesus Christ - that comes from the pits of hell. I know of nothing that says that we can't disagree, and still have Unity of the Spirit. We aren't all going to get along, but we can live in the Unity of the Spirit.

Here's something to consider. I believe that there are enough Christians and enough money in Abilene, Texas that not one person should go hungry for a night. Not on person should lack for comfort or a friend. What if all denominations, while keeping their own unique traditions, unified in an effort to offer love, food, and friendship to all who are in need? I tell you, we can gather together and solve many of the problems of this city. But we don't have to change who we are, or gather just we agree in every detail of doctrine. We can gather because we all hear the Father's voice.

You are right...but it is so easy to divide up over meaningless minutia. This is what drove me to find a new faith (well...part of it). Something that made sense to ME, and that i didn't have to trust the word of a man who was trying to raise funds for a new parish, or some other church project.